Posts by Band on the Run

14

Watchtower Attorneys Hayden Covington and Charles Smith

by Scott77 in

does anyone know some bios on those two guys?

are they nice, bad or just ordinary guys in the higher ups of the watchtower hierachy?

please, post some photos of them if available.. .

Band on the Run

My father liked him very much at Bethel. They were drinking buddies. Ten Thousand dollars is not much for a legal case, IMO. I realize it is a ton of money but legal cases are very expensive. It prevents true justice. The ACLU draws from the very best corporate law firms and top law school faculties. Their amicus briefs probably played a large role in those decisions. Knorr was irritated by attention to society's lawyers. Covington was more popular than Knorr from what I overheard. There were rumors of disfellowshipping for being so popular. As much as my father liked him, he would not even acknowledge him at a convention b/c of the rumors. We tried hard to find out the truth.

A lawyer can't guarantee results. His record was impressive. My mom had a very close family friend show off before the judge during sentencing. He proclaimed the court could not make him serve the govt. b/c he was dedicated to Jehovah. One youthful outburst severely increased his prison sentence. There was also Moyle.

If someone can explain to me how female lawyers can remain Witnesses I'd love to hear the tale. I had to fight to stay in high school. Lawyers are officers of the court with allegiances sworn to the federal and state constitution. It blows my mind. I had the same feeling watching Michael Jackson move across the state and enact sexual climax. If I ever grabbed my crotch at the Kingdom Hall, would I be courted. It simply outrages me. I came across a law journal article written by a female Witness during my own research. I even wrote her a note expressing my views of express not following Witness dictates. Why could I wash toilets while she had a luxurious life in some law school. The final straw for me was not only that she was a lawyer but that her college and law school were not fly by night operations.

12

Remnant Check by WTS

by Band on the Run in

there is a debate about the nature of the eucharist once consecrated, a church mouse appears and runs off with the host.

is it still christ's body?.

when i was a witness, only a literal handful could be annointed.

Band on the Run

I partake several times a week sometimes. When I first left the Witnesses, I was so confused about people partaking of the Eucharist. I decided over a period of time that I wanted to be one of them. It is anathema to deny communion in my denomination. I am just as worthy as anyone else. I practically passed out the first time.

These teachings of the Witnesses appear very piece-meal. They lack cohesion. The remnant was rah-rah until some "great crowds" came into power at Bethel. Fundamentally, all this revolves around whether a person can makes judgments. My judgmentas may well be flawed but I've never seen anything among the Witnesses to indicate they can do a better job for all people on this planet.

The more education I've received and the more experiences in the world I have, I realize I can at most have a very small core of knowledge. The enormity of what I don't known and can't know washes over me, a contrast to my high school days.

13

Halal versus Kosher food - who knew it was so complex?

by james_woods in

somebody who lived in the middle east posted this on my ferrari board - i had no idea that these dietary laws went into such detail:.

the slaughter must be ritually done (in a religiously based ritual fashion) for halal that means the name of allah has to be invoked individually on each animal to be slaughtered where for kosher, it is sufficient to recite the name of god or grace once for the day for all slaughters.. .

islam considers the entire cattle or sheep as halal if duly slaughtered but jews use only the fore-quarter as kosher and consider the hind-quarter as non-kosher.. .

Band on the Run

Gelatin from unclean sources is definitely not Kosher. There are gelatin substitutes available today so there prob. is some business making marshmallows that are kosher. The gelatin rules are very complicated. Wikipedia cites some modern scholars but the orthodox view is forbidden.

I only knew about pork from the Witnesses. When I started college, I was exposed to all these elaborate rules. I recall knife cuts are important. Dishes are cleaned in sand for Passover. The most informed, sophisticated people would obey these rules in an exacting manner. My roommate was Jewish through her mother's line. Her father was Latino so she was raised Catholic. When she hit university, it was her first exposure to Judaism really. She overcompensated for her lack of upbringing. It drew the ire of Jewish raised students. We were roommates and close friends. She was never under any illusion that I was not Christian but Jewish. Well, WWIII started when I brought in frozen shrimp cocktail as recommended by a fashion magazine for young women. There were constant skirmishes about food. There were many rooms available that were set aside as kosher.

It is not flattering to me but there were still Christian and Jewish law firms. On its face, you would be a token in the other religion's firm and get away with more stuff. I refused to feel awkward about food anymore. It was sad to me that we were all discussing religion as a major factor in a law career. Newer firms are different but the trad'l ones are still dominated by religious culture.

12

Remnant Check by WTS

by Band on the Run in

there is a debate about the nature of the eucharist once consecrated, a church mouse appears and runs off with the host.

is it still christ's body?.

when i was a witness, only a literal handful could be annointed.

Band on the Run

My great-grandfather was a member of the remnant. His daughter only saw her father who allowed her stepmother to abuse her terribly. She fought against his assertion but everyone else believed him. He was my Dutch grandfather. I could never figure out how my grandmother was not his wife.

I just heard the arguments back and forth. He lived to almost 100 years of age. I believed him. My kid's mind could not get around his being in heaven. I was particularly concerned about bathroom happenings. Since he was heaven, he could see me. I felt these pangs of modesty. There was no one I could discuss them with to gain an explanation. Whenever I changed my clothes, I worried he could see me.

Likewise, the convention speaker would declare Jehovah is here. I would like all right and spied the ventilation system to figure out where exactly was here. Memories of Moses had me afraid to stare at any one space. They truly need youth groups.

Thanks for the information.

9

How does the watchtower come up with it's dates? (607, 1878, 1914, 1975 etc)

by Sharpie in

hey folks sharpie here.. .

can you help me out to find out how the watchtower gets to the date 607 and is it used in the 1914 doctrine?

information about 1975 and other key years in the watchtower's history will be neat to have to, such as the date judge came up with involving the return of abraham, david, and others.

Band on the Run

I was so afraid of the numbers and pyramids. Ray Franz recounted one numbering fiasco in the early years with Russell. The main point had to do with the fulfillment of some prophecy when Russell's manuscript was delivered from Pittsburgh to NYC for publication. The event did not occur. So a prominent brother rechecked all the computations. He found that a train schedule had an incorrect mileage on its timetable. There was a spur in the track that delayed the train. He spoke to the work crews about this segment of track. Growing up in the NY area, it is hilarious that Pittsburgh would be a significant site for earth history. Furthermore, a choo-choo train going into Secaucus, NY sounded even funnier.

Besides the actual computation, I am interested in what in the contemporary culture prompted these men to believe the numbers had significance. Masonry is one element. I'm interested in anthropology. When you read Victorian certainty about finds in the Middle East or the racist beliefs of many excellent scientists concerning the measurements of Jews and African-Americans, it puts things in a different perspective. Of course, the rest of society moved on to other views.

12

Remnant Check by WTS

by Band on the Run in

there is a debate about the nature of the eucharist once consecrated, a church mouse appears and runs off with the host.

is it still christ's body?.

when i was a witness, only a literal handful could be annointed.

Band on the Run

Being one of the 144,000 before the throne had tremendous status in my day. Times may have evolved. I have several different Bible translations, synoptic gospel paralells, and commentaries. I truly don't need to have Bible verse pointed out to me, esp. in a fashion that the Society engages in to prove dubious points. Context is important to me. It does get on my nerves.

If it is not special, why do more and more believe they are special? The privacy between the claimant and God sounds so atypical of the Witnesses. If you are out more than one year, it seems that you are truly out b/c everything changes.

Civility is something I wish to achieve. The Witnesses hurt me to my core. I don't need snide comments here. It may your right but I don't understand the better than you are comments. I have studiously avoided Witnesses like the plague for decades. It seems the personality may stay the same even after some leave.

50

What would you hate about the Paradise...

by Butterflyleia85 in

jw
friends

well i was thinking... kinda random stuff this morning.

there was on the news of volcano eruption in brussel and it was so cool looking.

no injuries were found but i got to see the lava and thinking how beautiful it was.

Band on the Run

Cleaning up all the dead bodies of good people. As a child, I used to fret that everyone I cared about was a goner while the people surviving would be JW idiots with no intelligence or culture. I would detest it. No ballet, opera, Beatles, R & B, jazz.....Only the JW songs. No fashion. No great works of literature, only WTS publications.

Jean Paul Sartre, the French existentialist, wrote a famous play called No Exit. It is Hell depicted as a small group of people not relating to each other in any way for eternity. The play chilled me. Sartre evidently knew Witness culture.

13

Halal versus Kosher food - who knew it was so complex?

by james_woods in

somebody who lived in the middle east posted this on my ferrari board - i had no idea that these dietary laws went into such detail:.

the slaughter must be ritually done (in a religiously based ritual fashion) for halal that means the name of allah has to be invoked individually on each animal to be slaughtered where for kosher, it is sufficient to recite the name of god or grace once for the day for all slaughters.. .

islam considers the entire cattle or sheep as halal if duly slaughtered but jews use only the fore-quarter as kosher and consider the hind-quarter as non-kosher.. .

Band on the Run

I lived with many orthdox Jesus people in Manhattan. They won't eat marshmallows b/c of the gelatin, which I was told is very unkosher. Now I have to check a rabbinic site.

I wonder whether these dietary laws existed in the earlier cultures and the Islamic and Jewish codes just enshrined them. Do you go to sleep one night and learn that what is clean, is now unclean. Everyone comments that these laws were integral to public safety in the climates they lived.

30

What is the WTS take on Speaking in Tongues?

by Lion Cask in

this is a fairly worldly view, for those who haven't seen it.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x3be9wcawim.

Band on the Run

I don't think we need every half verse in which the Holy Spirit is mentioned in the scriptures. Aren't the gifts listed in one of the Corinithians? They used to say the powers faded away. I'd like to know the precise date the Holy Spirit no longer manifested itself as Paul writes that it does exist. I remember hearing we no longer live in the age of miracles. Their God sounds very puny to me.

12

Remnant Check by WTS

by Band on the Run in

there is a debate about the nature of the eucharist once consecrated, a church mouse appears and runs off with the host.

is it still christ's body?.

when i was a witness, only a literal handful could be annointed.

Band on the Run

They were the same in my day. Of course, perhaps the anointed are no longer a remnant. The policy changes all the time.